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*** Topic for #bricolabs set by phil_praxis on Friday, March 6, 2009 03:11:20
#bricolabs: jaceee drbrian hybrid paulav kiilo lalenia __YupanaKernel__ hj4adj
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jaceee: hei folks ... john here in Colorado... meeting starts in, what, 3.5 hours?
patadeperr: hola
tapmak: hola
tapmak: chat in 20 mins was it so?
patadeperr: yes ok se u then
tapmak: yo!
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jaceee: ei all -- hola --
jerneja: ciao!
briandegge: hello,
jaceee: Tapio -- what would the dates be for going with you to do the text before the festival? I'm trying to figure out if I have the time to finish with university and get to Finland
jaceee: inMay
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briandegge: finishing a job app tonight so will be semi-present
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patadeperr: paula estas?
tapmak: Hi, sorry for the dormancy, now on-line. Hi John, Jerneja, Maira, Brian, allez!
maira: Hi Tapio :)
jaceee: hei everyone...!
patadeperr: hello
patadeperr: i have not been present in last reunions
patadeperr: could someone sort of sum things up if there seems to be time for that?
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tapmak: Mayday Maydays? People arrive to Pixelache mostly for / on Thursday. Bricolabs events in Helsinki are on Friday 17th. It depens on how many days, I would say 3 minimum on the island?
jerneja: hello Felipe
jaceee: There is info at http://piratepad.net/bricolacheplan, Pata
lalenia: Title: PiratePad: Create a new pad? (at piratepad.net)
jerneja: yes, three days sounds good
efeefe: hi all
efeefe: coffee and banana pie, anyone?
jaceee: Okay, so I should arrive in Finland (if I can!), say, 11-12 May at the latest...
efeefe: new recipe here, wet pie
patadeperr: seems to be very little presence from the south
jaceee: uff, it would be really tight for me...
tapmak: ie. arrival 11th or 12th on the weekend to Helsinki, making the journey to the island on that Sunday -> Monday/Tuesday/Wednesday there leaving Thursday early is one option. But there are folks who'd want or need to be in Helsinki already on Wednesday.
jerneja: pie, yes please
efeefe: are you talking about the island?
jaceee: right, so, 10-11 would be even better...
maira: oi efeefe
tapmak: yes, island pre workshop date options, John was asking.
efeefe: wednesday 15th is the opening
jaceee: damn, I wish everthing was a week later!!
efeefe: patadeperro: indeed, little people from the south. what can we do about it?
jaceee: it also takes me a full 24 hours to get from the US to HLK
efeefe: one thing is: tickets are expensive
jaceee: extreme expensive!
efeefe: I'll try to get extra funding from brazilian ministry of culture
jaceee: heh, the US has no ministry of culture!
efeefe: to bring people over
efeefe: jaceee: yeah, that's awkward
efeefe: there's no institution you can ask funding for?
tapmak: There are tickets on sale right now by KLM. Helsinki-Sampa/Rio-Helsinki for 750-800 euros return. Not sure it works the other way btw...
patadeperr: how much of the budget from Pixelache will be for travel?
jaceee: I am more or less planning to cover my own expenses, although housing help in HLK might be helpful
patadeperr: sounds cheap
efeefe: patadeperro: it's up to us to decide about that
tapmak: mmm... should we have an agenda for this session? I am happy to give airline etc tips later
jaceee: no, efeefe, I am without an institutional home in the US, and so, no one to ask (even if I was more closely attached to teh Uni here, they do not routinely cover things like this except for very senior faculty
efeefe: 800 euros are a good price
patadeperr: should keep $ to pay for people from south
patadeperr: i see camilo will be representing cooperaciones
efeefe: patadeperro: yes, but still waiting for proposlas
patadeperr: thats cool
efeefe: had only two, so far
efeefe: actually, Alejo suggested Camilo but I didn't ask Camilo whether he would be available/intersted
tapmak: The more people can get travel grants the better of course, and as a local my budget need is zero a^�‚�Ê so you can count me in as cheap labour. :)
patadeperr: i think it would be ok to look outside the inmdiate network
efeefe: hj4adj: estas ahi?
efeefe: let's exploit tapio!
tapmak: work the dog
patadeperr: ok
jaceee: hehe...
patadeperr: will medellin be paying for Camilo?
jaceee: arf arf!
efeefe: patadeperro: indeed, we should asap come up with a coherent bricolabs thematic proposal in order to make things more concrete
efeefe: patadeperro: I have no idea
patadeperr: ok
jerneja: funding in slovenia is at the moment not existent. on 8.feb, national culture day, there will be an overall country demonstration agains the government
efeefe: we haven't discussed that yet
patadeperr: i really dont understand much from the pad
patadeperr: i see the conferences are pretty clear which is good but we should go beyong conferences
efeefe: patadeperro: it wouldn't be that easy :D
efeefe: they expect us to propose conference, exhibition and if we want workshops
efeefe: we want to work towards a publication/reader as well
jaceee: hmm, they have one-way from Denver to Hlk for EUR 350
jerneja: the thing is that the proposal is also for an exhibition, but setting up an open lab is not something pixelache wants. so here is a challenge as well
tapmak: suggestion... a) identify participants who have funds for travel and who can moderate brico sessions locally. b) from themes in the programme around moderators and speakers + add on-line participation (Helsinki). Then see what really makes sense for the programme, how much budget is spent/left and invest the rest into travel bursaries + fees of non-local labour like Felipe.
efeefe: there will be the pixelache camp during the two days in Naissari
patadeperr: i dont think they need the exhibition
efeefe: the lab can take place there
jaceee: so a panel session at the conference, a physical installation as exhibition , and then the workshop?
efeefe: patadeperro: what would you suggest?
patadeperr: the presentations seem ok
patadeperr: i would like to propose the palomino streaming
jerneja: yes, the island symbolically means "island of women"
jaceee: what's the palomino?
patadeperr: if you wish I could explain, could be like an exhibition project in a way
patadeperr: we have a space in the jungle where we are developing alternative way of living
efeefe: patadeperro: please do
patadeperr: its 15 acres
patadeperr: by a big river
patadeperr: near indigenous people
patadeperr: we dont have internet yet but we have solar eergy and we are figuring out the internet now
patadeperr: the idea woud be to invite a finish person to come over for 2 weeks
jaceee: ?do�Lnde? ?co�Lmo se llama por favor...?
jaceee: sounds good!
patadeperr: and he or she would be doing a sort of reality
patadeperr: lso a permanant stream or little documentaries going up online all the time
patadeperr: there is window to this in Helsinki
efeefe: why would you need someone from finland there?
patadeperr: perhaps we have some cameras with motion detectors
patadeperr: at night in the forest or by the river where people come wash their clothes etc.
patadeperr: also its about how we live life there
patadeperr: how we deal with the garbaje, cooking,
patadeperr: planting
efeefe: so the idea is a continuous live stream?
patadeperr: making offerings to nature
tapmak: what kind of activities do you do on the 15 acres? okay so sustainable living experiment?
patadeperr: sort of but we dont know how possible that is
jaceee: it's interesting that we always come back to the necessity of f2f
efeefe: yeah
efeefe: I think a lot of people would have similar ideas
patadeperr: we know we will have internet on the top of the mountin but we dont know about
patadeperr: the bottom
efeefe: Maira proposed the ferrysouth, relating the Riacho Grande ferry, etc.
maira: yes ;)
efeefe: Vince proposed remote participation
patadeperr: yes susteainable living + indigenous people talking about wahts going on in the region + the probelm of lack of conectivity
patadeperr: DIY technologies
tapmak: Here is an art and farming project from Sweden some of you may know http://kultivator.org/ (Sounds good what you are describing)
efeefe: My only concern is, spending part of our budget to pay someone from finland to go to Colombia sounds a little awkward
lalenia: Title: Kultivator (at kultivator.org)
jerneja: what about a documentary.i believe would be really interesting
patadeperr: would we not be able to get a ticket from the form the goverment, from another source?
efeefe: patadeperro: there are similar conditions in other places as well
jerneja: many of the realities of bricolabs on video, being captures in this time laps, then brought together. it would give lots of insights, low cost as well. good documentation for later
tapmak: We have 3 months + some 2 weeks
efeefe: Nuvem, in Visconde de Maua, has been trying to handle poor connectivity
efeefe: the exhibition can focus on local realities
patadeperr: so windows into diferent sites could be set up in a room
efeefe: patadeperro: indeed. either live or minidocs
tapmak: I think Pixelache is a good place to brainstorm such a project and then set it in motion as a concept. You could make application forms for such a residency...?
patadeperr: i would have a few monitors open
efeefe: or else, whatever one location wants to propose
patadeperr: try to do it live open for 3 days and if not possible people sending docs
efeefe: but that leads to another question: we are talking about deep resonance, right?
tapmak: I have one domain name I reserved for an unrealized project that could be of interest... livingrelations.org
efeefe: so, showing up a lot of particular configurations is a kind of a contradiction, isn't it?
jaceee: how so efeefe?
patadeperr: dicothomies
efeefe: if we only open particular realities for exhibition, where is the resonance there?
patadeperr: well we are defenetly not seemless
jaceee: the resonance can be made explicit in the humans who are participating...
patadeperr: but yes we are all doing the same things
efeefe: merely being connected is resonating?
efeefe: patadeperro: what kinds of things?
jaceee: no-no, there are overlying principles and vibes that resonate
jaceee: so those need to be drawn out...
patadeperr: yeah
efeefe: (I do imagine, but let me know your take)
jaceee: and made explicit to an audience...
patadeperr: in palomino we make offerings before cutting a tree or taking a rivers water, i imagine that in brazil too,
jaceee: well, a situation where there can be dialogues with any sort of audience, definitely is necessary
patadeperr: a ritual diferent, but a ritual
patadeperr: we recicle
efeefe: jaceee: maybe then the focus should lie in what's resonating here (at least for the exhibition)
jaceee: not merely 'showing a stream feed': here it is...
patadeperr: we struggle with the internet
jaceee: and yet even with the high level of mediation, we are able to make something happen
efeefe: jaceee: genau
jaceee: it is the quality of any dialogue that is stimulated or that we focus on making happen
jaceee: that draws in an audience
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jaceee: and transforms them into being a participant
patadeperr: I am not sure I understand all this resonating stuff but if you want
patadeperr: the public to Produce or be filled with a deep, full, reverberating sound.
tapmak: I guess one thing that emerges here is that it is important not only to express different localities through visual presence or description, but to express how through bricolabs practices and shared ideas, in fact these contexts may have shifted, how there are issues shared, and learning takes place multi directionally, informally, on-line or when visiting a site.
jaceee: jep...
efeefe: jaceee: can you try to resonate deeper here?
efeefe: ;)
lalenia: efeefe: Error: ")" is not a valid command.
patadeperr: or perhaps simply all concentrate on one consept so we can all make it "resonate" strong and clear..?????
tapmak: an imaginary argument: "Don't try to resonate with me!"
efeefe: resonate is the concept, I think
jaceee: hahe, um, well, certainly what Tapio says, in articulating those thing actively (not passively), in whatevver our 'venue' is in FI, we can draw people into the dialogue...
efeefe: there was also the idea of "generic infrastructures" through which Rob seduced a lot of people in the first days of Bricolabs
jaceee: well, yes, many do resist resonance, or deny it is happpening...
jaceee: because it is a powerful influence that goes deep into the psyche
efeefe: Alejo mentioned 'free/open infrastructures' would be more precise
tapmak: can I say a few words of what was shared today at Pixelache office?
efeefe: but anyway, the idea of creating your own infrastructure or parts of it is very present, I reckon
jerneja: yes, so the visual description wouldn't be just an agglomerate, but if produced with in mind the concept of resonating, by leaning, communicating...somehow it could open the imaginary of the audience, aka having to take that into account for FI.
jaceee: yes, infrastructure, but or me the materialist interpretation is just too tired -- I rather move towards, into the human relation itself
efeefe: so patadeperro, you solving connectivity issues and dealing with sewage or garbage are pretty much in the same direction
jerneja: tapmak: go ahead
efeefe: tapmak: please do
tapmak: I actually like from Jerneja one word which may have been a typo, leaning
patadeperr: you got me
jaceee: it might be possible to illustrate resonance between different feeds -- with people attempting the same tasks in totally different laces
jerneja: typo.nice one
efeefe: jaceee: subjective infrastructures, was it?
tapmak: coz learning is often also too formalistic and through these networks of (resonance) we actualy get a lot of support, lean on each other's experiences and ideas
jaceee: resonance in engineering, as a totally different example, is a very important concept...
tapmak: but to the meeting today with Pixelache...
jaceee: how things are done, resonating between technological implementation...
jaceee: go ahead Tap
tapmak: Friday 17th is indeed THE brico day
jaceee: uhuh
tapmak: So we are then situated in Suvilahti, former gas plant of city of Helsinki, now a cultural venue with several spaces to be in
tapmak: For this day they expect audience, not only already initiated participants
tapmak: and bricolabs is chosen as a proposal also because the network cuts across geographical stereotypes etc
efeefe: (Nathalie also mentioned the exhibition opening could be the 15th)
tapmak: So expressing how brico projects have come about, what emergetn discourses are there now, to engage people to debate is the thing for Friday, perhaps??
tapmak: By audience and participants we talk ideally 200 people
tapmak: While on Ferry + Naissaari it is max 100 people all together
jaceee: whoa -- that's a lot of folks!
patadeperr: nice
jaceee: what is the ambience of the coming-together space in Suvilahti?
tapmak: = the latter is then for more workshopping, brainstorming etc, but network connectivity is very low
tapmak: Suvilahti is great
jaceee: and the time frame for that part of Friday?
tapmak: If you look up Flwo Festival for music, it is that area
jaceee: Pixelache is always very busy day & nite!
patadeperr: images?
tapmak: We have most of Friday. One book launch and I think evening there was a keynote but other than that - Friday 17th Pixalache = Brico
tapmak: And as it happens, the proposal that Felipe wrote _resonated_ the Pixelache theme well.
jaceee: wow, sounds good!
efeefe: I've got some images, just a second
tapmak: So on Friday, to express how our networked modes of collaboration form inter-subjective geographies (or ignore geographies) is one important thing to express or debate in several ways
jaceee: somehow, it'd be great to have, for example, small working groups in a bigger space, people interacting in small groups and forming into bigger groups at some times, then going back to smaller groups
tapmak: But Pixelache is NOT an academic conference style thing
efeefe: from Ulla's email: " Pictures of the different exhibition venues that can be found on Nathalie's Flickr atA^ 
efeefe: http://www.flickr.com/photos/27126283@N07/sets/72157632568072327/"
jaceee: with individual bricos facilitating thematics in small groups
efeefe: jaceee: big/small groups could be better in Naissari, isn'tit?
tapmak: So mostly we should just be ourselves really, share projects and current debates, moderate people to participate to discussion and engage. But to talk in ways that also folks not fully internal to these discourses can understand = from practices up.
efeefe: http://www.suvilahti.fi/front-page/
lalenia: Title: Suvilahti �t Home (at www.suvilahti.fi)
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tapmak: Day before, lot of dialogue on recycling and urban farms etc. will come about, 3d printer from recycled plastics proejcts and so on....
efeefe: yes, the 16th will be interesting as well
jaceee: yes, that's what I mean -- efeefe - if we have all day Friday, though, it's be tiresome o have just big panels and presentations
tapmak: which connects nicely
tapmak: I asked about programme structure
tapmak: they thought max two streams, and good to keep folks together at key points
jaceee: (hmm, Tapio, and feel for the acoustics in those spaces -- they look echo-y for conversations and such
tapmak: but can be breakout sessions with demos.
tapmak: There are all types of spaces there. We'll get more specs soonish.
jerneja: there is this world cafe methodology. where people sits around a table, make it carpet. making for example sure one brico is at each table that could be the moderator... and initiates discussion.
efeefe: jerneja: I don't like it
tapmak: I think it would be great to do something like that for part of the day - bricolunch ?
patadeperr: so your saying to talk?
efeefe: kills spontaneity
patadeperr: just talking? or maing things?
jaceee: yes, jerneja, that's what I was suggesting -- and a movement between larger groups and smaller groups...
efeefe: brico-picnic somewhere?
efeefe: DIY cooking?
jerneja: no need to be rigid in form
jerneja: just to illustrate really
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efeefe: patadeperro: I would go for making thins while in Naissari
patadeperr: I dont think there should be too much talking just making
efeefe: especially because of poor connectivity
jaceee: yes, preparing & sharing food is also a strong statement -- we should have it in the conference plan that food is shared at least for lunch!
efeefe: there are lots of people working with local/negotiated connectivity
tapmak: hmm... If early programme took on different topics, say 2-4 - and then there were respective break-out sessions /tables /picnics
tapmak: Pixelache organization is called Piknik Frequency :D
jaceee: brico-picnic
jaceee: ah yeah, that's right ...
jaceee: it all fits!
jerneja: cheers to that
jaceee: jep
tapmak: Need to see how on-line participation could flow with that also...
efeefe: tapmak: indeed
patadeperr: sorry I dont understand its all going to be a big discussion with picnic breaks?
efeefe: for south america, european afternoon is better for online partic
jaceee: having connectivity at each table would be nice
tapmak: "picnic" is a way to see an unconference mode where you break an audience into sessions where you can a) demo things and discuss. Coz the audience will be 100-200 ppl.
jaceee: yes, we will have to overcome the schedule issues, it's always a pain!
patadeperr: demo things and discuss...
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tapmak: connectivity will not be a hurdle in the Helsinki venue, needs to be taken care of but when we specify what, when and where needed we get WiFi
patadeperr: a reminder: bricolage is the construction or creation of a work from a diverse range of things that happen to be available, or a work created by such a process.
efeefe: patadeperro: indeed, but we can also discuss bricolage, can we not?
patadeperr: Im sorry I just think that discussion is not what we should be doing.
patadeperr: it is not my opinion
tapmak: I think the audience would be best energized by sharing realized projects and some ongoing processes (like the brick phone and satellite related work) as well as local labs and networks.
briandegge: frontline sms server perhaps to connect w south?
efeefe: briandegger: define 'south' :P
efeefe: here in Brazil, SMS is way too expensive
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patadeperr: one defenition: action over theory
jaceee: bricolage can also be tied to the idea of people having a f2f interaction and creating ideas as well as actions and things
efeefe: not a feasible option
efeefe: bricolating ideas
kdag silently moves to the back and listens (hola btw)
tapmak: patadeperro: during 18th and 19th it is all about workshopping and doing things together, especially in Estonia. Ferry, well not so much hands on but we have more intimate spaces on those big ships for us to use.
jaceee: yes, as we have a variety of venues and situations to deal with , we simply implement what seems best...
patadeperr: ok
jaceee: of course planning is necessary too... ;-)
patadeperr: dindt get that sorry
briandegge: south = not where we are....
efeefe: thinking without doing // doing without thinking etc.
kdag: south is where is warm, could be a sauna
tapmak: Hi Alejo - will you be physically on site in Helsinki, to take a sauna?
briandegge: south is where equatorial satellite hopping/squatting is possible
kdag: tapmak: dear i dont know
kdag: tapmak: i wish i can make it
tapmak: Sauna is where my South is (a placard on my wall) - or was that in reverse?
briandegge: anyone interested in portable rocketstove making/cooking
jerneja: ok. i'll just share it with you now. there is a new institute in Slovenia, called KSEVT. it investigates the space, or actually it deals with the culturalization of space. leaving the military or commercial infrastructures, which are being build now...it has its own new building. you can read more about it here. so it goes, it deals with the local the regional and the planettary.http://www.culture.si/en/Cultural_Centre_of_European_
kdag: great.. palindrome
tapmak:kdag: I do wish you can make it.
jaceee: I sure as hell will be doing saunas in HLK if I make it there!!!
briandegge: north=sauna.... :)
briandegge: (enough geography) Sauna is a special place
kdag: jerneja: is that where marko collaborates also?
jerneja: and the orbits, satellites, arts and technology, are really close
jerneja: yes, they just opened an exhibition at UCR california riverside
jerneja: and KSEVT - I went there yesterday.
kdag: i like the topic of latitudes and how they re projected up into space.. latitud 0 and the geos, but how is that related now with pixeache?
jerneja: Marko co-curated the exhibition, another link: http://ucrtoday.ucr.edu/11337
lalenia: Title: UCR Today: UCR ARTSblock Exhibition Focuses on Citizen Space Exploration (at ucrtoday.ucr.edu)
kdag: jerneja: i see a relation via free infrastructures
tapmak:kdag: latitude as defined by /as?
kdag: that imaginary line that divides north and south and when looked from 36000km serves as home for satcom mil sats..
jerneja: free open infrastructure that is the bricoplan
jaceee: hmmm, it's hard for me to overlook the deep connection with that exhibition to military-industrial roots
tapmak: The physical space where we will be in Naissaari is a birthplace of a guy, who even though lost one arm at early age, made his living sanding lenses for telescopes. And then he invented some techniques.
kdag: yes
kdag: i mentioned that tapmak on the first meeting
tapmak: This space was closed military sea mine plant for the Soviet era...
tapmak:kdag: nice
kdag: i have a schmidt caseegarian telescope
tapmak: ditto
efeefe: ops, sorry - was away for a couple minutes
jerneja: can see your point john, but making some shifts
kdag: jerneja: i resonate with this -> free open infrastructure that is the bricoplan
jaceee: big space science is so deeply connected to the MIC that it's impossible to make a separation imho...
efeefe: ksevt + msst
kdag: as a way to guide and requesto some works from bricolabs participants
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kdag: few days ago i though on asking philippe for the al-cadie
jaceee: that's why, perhaps the resonances of the earth's magnetic field in bio-systems might be better than dealing with satellites
jerneja: efeefe: msst?
kdag: james will say sats are victorian age technology :)
efeefe:kdag: latitud 0 is really significant if we talk about north/south, innit?
kdag: poetic
tapmak: One way to approach the whole is to identify people who want to moderate a combination of local participants + online participants to first present, then debate / brainstorm /body storm it further (along the lines of free/open infras.
jerneja: super poetic
efeefe: I reckon MSST could be portrayed as well
jaceee: magnets aren't tho...
efeefe: +1kdag: jerneja: i resonate with this -> free open infrastructure that is the bricoplan
efeefe: "infrastructure" meaning more than usually oes
efeefe: does
briandegge: 0
efeefe: jerneja: the sateliteless movement
briandegge: naice
tapmak: Zero patience
efeefe: lat-
efeefe: lat0
jaceee: so a re-configurable space with a variety of possibilities of coming together at different scales/ways on Friday would be a simple starting point
jaceee: then filling out the potentials
efeefe: anyways, we have...
jerneja: efeffe: good to work on that for the reader
jerneja: ps efeefe
tapmak: A project by Sreejata & Joy from Delhi could be interesting to involve: www.invisibleconstellation.net
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kdag: o/ intertwilight
tapmak: Sreejata: "a participatory work and is mapping the narratives on demolition, gentrification, migration and displacement of any city in the world, you have experienced. It would be nice if you could also ask any other artists/ urban designer/ architect/ urban /social researcher or anybody who is affected by this to add star with narratives/ images/link"
intertwili: greetings bricos ... just getting in after the transmediale Marshall McLuhan lecture ...
intertwili: (stephen kovats in berlin here)
efeefe: 15th good moment for exhib opening
efeefe: 17th brico-day in helsinki
efeefe: 17th/18th ferry, etc.
efeefe: 18th workshops/hands-on/working groups
efeefe: 19th idem + closing
efeefe: in parallel, exhibition and reader/research/etc.
jaceee: I just hope I can swing it to get to FI...
jaceee: BTW if anyone knows of any interesting post-doc research positions anywhere in the world, let me konw... I'm aiming to get out of the US again asap...
tapmak: my hunch is that reader + talks + meetings is a lot of things to keep going for those of us who get/are there. An exhibition component would need to be assessed how it could be realized, who could take responsibility over it?
jaceee: any more parameters on the Reader? I haven't been able to give it much thought
tapmak: otherwise the schedule efe outlined is good - also we have a few ppl who could join for a pre event with sauna, food - and of course, discussion and editing.
jaceee: I don't think I want to be involved in the exhibition part -- it's not my skill set...
jaceee: jep
efeefe: tapmak: indeed, it'd be great if someone could be responsible for the exhibition
kdag: I could help felipe on that front, at least to get works from few people
briandegge: Reader in open ecologies and technologies :) ?
briandegge: I am more interested in workshopology than exhibitions
efeefe:kdag: refine the idea behind the exhibition and then getting works, right?
efeefe: briandegger: reader in brico-themes
kdag: yes, but id i understand pixelache wants that to happen, show some works
kdag: s/id/if
efeefe: one idea is to dive into bricolabs archives and find relevant themes/moments/solutions
jaceee: Hmmm, I might be able to pull in Lonny Grafman from appropedia http://www.appropedia.org/Appropedia:About
lalenia: Title: Appropedia:About - Appropedia: The sustainability wiki (at www.appropedia.org)
briandegge: brico-themes . got it....
patadeperr: i want to make a mud hut.
efeefe: patadeperro: in helsinki?
patadeperr: why not
kdag: :)
patadeperr: In the exhibition space
patadeperr: we could turn it into a sauna
kdag: smells !
tapmak: Pixelache works = projects, demos, designs; though sometimes there have been installations in more classical sense (what ever that might be).
efeefe: there's a text cooking here: http://piratepad.net/bricolachetext
lalenia: Title: PiratePad: bricolachetext (at piratepad.net)
jerneja: the idea is to have brico interviews also everyone please contribute with your elaborations on facing north/facing south..or any particularities...briandegger, workshopology i agree. kdag yes they do want that
efeefe: (had comments already to change its direction though)
efeefe: tapmak: can we get a lot of mud there?
efeefe: ;)
lalenia: efeefe: Error: ")" is not a valid command.
efeefe: lalenia: I didn't ask
lalenia: efeefe: Error: "I" is not a valid command.
tapmak: efeefe: is mud a new drug I should know about?
kdag: i've learnt about MUDs in Tornio
tapmak: sure thing, MUD opera
efeefe: hah
jaceee: hehehe, kdag, ancient history ;-)
patadeperr: DIY house, the basics
patadeperr: but makes you free
kdag: http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:La_casa_de_barro.jpg
lalenia: (at it.wikipedia.org)
intertwili: idea on reader: perhaps it could be a brico follow-up, or expansion on the 'Bandung Declaration of Open Cultures, Technologies and Ecologies' which was penned and passed at Common Room Bandung in 2010
intertwili: http://culture360.org/magazine/new-ways-of-promoting-artistic-and-cultural-expressions/
tapmak: we hae a lot of snow handy at the moment
lalenia: (at culture360.org)
intertwili: direct link to the Declaration here:
intertwili: http://culture360.org/wp-content/blogs.dir/1/files/2011/04/BandungDeclaration2010.pdf?ef6f3c
lalenia: (at culture360.org)
kdag: intertwilight: the bandung declaration.. fundamental
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intertwili: it marked only the beginning of a discussion, that seems may be appropriate in the pixelache context
kdag: it relates to the bogota declaration (on the geostationary orbit we mentioned earlier)
intertwili: and was part-brico document
intertwili: yes
tapmak: I don't remember if this translates... but in Finnish, we say "KA?det savessa" meaning hands in the mud, meaning, doing practice, getting it done.
kdag: gustaff mithg like it
intertwili: sorry, missed the earlier discussion
jaceee: so, should we formulate a call on the brico list that everyone(!) pair up for a email-based text dialogues/interviews (many of them) that we could then use in the text?
jerneja: yes. good one!
jaceee: tapio -- i also recall a nt-so-nice Finnish expression : "Mud People" for immigrants, eh?
patadeperr: technology and theory are very north...
efeefe: jaceee: call for brico-list, yes!
jerneja: tapmak doubledecked ony our table this one
patadeperr: i think...it would be good to have some basic stuff going on..
efeefe: patadeperro: I don't believe in north
tapmak: jacee: close.
patadeperr: how about the masculine?
kdag: patadeperro: i think i see your point, dont agree on that tech is north.. see theory more north... tech is everywhere
efeefe: I don't like dicothomies
efeefe: anyway
jaceee: trichotomies are more fun ;-)
kdag: but yes, i see it crucial to have things happening
efeefe: pancothomies
efeefe:kdag: agreed
tapmak: engagement first through practices
efeefe: we can break the 17th into early talking and then split sessions with demos, presentations and if someone offers, more practical stuff
efeefe: then the 18th we can think of real concrete doing etc.
jaceee: I'm going to write something on the piratepad about a brico call to establish dialogue partners for dialogue/interviews...
efeefe: jerneja and jaceee will brew a brico-call for reader, right? it would be great if someone offered to dive into brico-archives.
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efeefe: (I heard you thinking)
efeefe: me and alejo will discuss further the ideas for exhibition, etc. anyone willing to join us is welcome. tapmak you in?
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efeefe: for the 17th, do you people think we should first refine the text in the pad, or instead start thinking of conference/sessions/workinggroups/presentations already?
tapmak: ps. one dichotomy I don't appreciate personally is saying practice and theory are opposites, or that one is more benevolent than the other. There can be grounded theory and pointless practice, so to speak, and paradoxically again in reverse.
tapmak: efeefe: sure, I am in.
jaceee: thougth and action has to be unified!
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jerneja: think simultaneuosly can do, we need to deliver the text by when, now, or? brake down the sessions later...
tapmak: In general, there is not enough TIY in this world (Think It Yourself)
efeefe: iuriguilherme: fala maluco
iuriguilhe: efeefe: te conheA�˜o?
iuriguilhe: :D
efeefe: jerneja: they expect us to come up with a text for pixelache weblog these days
tapmak: efeefe: it would be good to make draft theme sessions and ask folks to propose more, and people could sign up writing up brief descriptions as well as offer themselves as moderators / interventors for those
efeefe: it's not supposed to be our ultimate statement, just to point to things we're trying to do in our part of the programme
tapmak: but yes, if the meta description is done first, the rest can follow over the course of next two months.
jaceee: shiite -- can't paste into the chat window...
jerneja: spoon feed the window
jerneja: haha
jaceee: I just wrote a quick frame for a dialogue/interview call on the piratepad in dark green
jaceee: under "Ideas"
efeefe: btw, I've put ulla's email on venues here: http://piratepad.net/bricolachevenues
lalenia: Title: PiratePad: bricolachevenues (at piratepad.net)
efeefe: only the pictures are missing
tapmak: Ville showed some nice images from Naissaari. I can put those up some place or share links as he does.
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kdag: could it be that vanessas point on: tech-theory->masculine be addressed on that TIY "call" the gender issues that to even mention create categories that i guess we strive to leave without disregarding... how to read her last comments..
kdag: vx: you there?
jaceee: my IRC client is Carbon-based (not living carbon, but old Mac carbon)...
vx: sort of! hey everyone!
efeefe: tapmak: please share Naissari photos, I haven't seen those yet
jaceee: Ei V.!
kdag: jaceee: seems like you wanted to spam the channel and got blocked :)
jaceee: no, it's my client... ancient IRCle, actually not sure why it's running on my OS at all!
efeefe: vx: vem pra ca, gringa!
kdag: jaja
jaceee: it seems to be logging, but no copy-paste...
vx: but vanessa has gone... i am just reading and thinking about your proposals while taking part in 2 other online discussions so need to process it all....i have a couple of groups who would like to participate remotely depending on the scope....
kdag: oke
efeefe: vx: can you help setting remote sessions then?
vx: and certainly i am happy to help to continue with the work done on the bandung declaration...
jaceee: anyway, if any wants to look at that and give me some feedback or ideas how to implement, I'd appreciate it...
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efeefe: we didn't discuss it much today, but I think it is important, to have a sense on resonant non-geography
vx: yes - certainly. i might be very remote (jungle in peru) but can get to a connection for the days of the sessions and i spoke to some people in manchester today as well who are interested...depending on how things end up
vx: possibility i will be in colombia too though with vanessa....this has been discussed too
vx: we can make an igloo in the jungle near palomino?
patadeperr: sorry I was offline for a while
intertwili: I won't be able to go to HEL/TAL, but if there is interest, I'm happy to host/chair an online discussion or remote session - perhaps on the Declaration and its development/manifestation
intertwili: or any other issues you may want some berlin input on ...
vx: one thing i was thinking about was how bricolabs could be creating solutions for knowledge sharing between north and south - hardly rocket science and really what we do every day....but maybe some sort of demonstration of this...
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efeefe: vx: could you help us planning the remote sessions beforehand as well?
vx: trying to get beyond the north and south....more into p2p territory and yes efeefe am happy to assist
kdag: question, simple one, will you produce some doc of how to build such MUD HUT? wouldnt that be a theoretical desc of a technology no matter what objects and actors are involved?
patadeperr: how do you imagien we could do the remote sessions?
vx: talking in about 3 mins to 2 network experts - one in mexico and one in australia....who i did try to intro to bricolabs a while back but nothing came of it - ooh and here the call is - will be back in a beat!
patadeperr: imagine
kdag: vx: p2p lead to onion networks (TOR) and hiddenServices back to infrastructures, latency and opacity
efeefe: I like cross-streaming plus IRC ;)
kdag: leads me ^
kdag: not far from streaming
kiilo: try n2n
patadeperr: so small session scedualed at particualr times?
efeefe:kdag: you obsesses type
kdag: same area code
kiilo: easy setup
kiilo: n2n VPN is a no brainer
efeefe: patadeperro: either small sessions precisely schedule
kdag: ola kiilo !
jaceee: yeah, cross-streaming + IRC seems to best == technically stable with options...
kiilo: ola
efeefe: or an open screen in HLK with lots of remote venues connecting where they see fit, tending to chaos
efeefe: what I do like
kdag: too much abbreviautures
kdag: tech abbrev
patadeperr: i like the caos option
patadeperr: yeah
efeefe: is that southern?
efeefe: heh
kdag: that is... webRTC
kiilo: yea
patadeperr: maybe a motion control that decides which strem gets to go
kiilo: hot topic
patadeperr: yes I think so efe, its organic
jaceee: how many people here would be willing to engage with one other brico in an extended interview/dialogue via email in the next month? (just a survey)
patadeperr: sexy brico?
jaceee: talking on whatever topics arose naturally between them...
efeefe:kdag: are you testing it?
tapmak: somehow it could be a blind date.
efeefe: webrtc I mean
efeefe: best motion control is human finger
patadeperr: one option
efeefe: no need to make it more complex in my opinion
kdag: yes, we have done tests.. but you have the google hangouts as a way to see it
patadeperr: i understand
efeefe: jaceee: +1
efeefe:kdag: does hangout use webrtc?
kdag: yes
patadeperr: i too like Jaceee's idea
patadeperr: even if its more theory
kdag: efeefe: we can test and set up a server fot that.. make a note
efeefe:kdag: could be a way to go
kdag: indeed
jaceee: it's not theory -- it is about the Self encountering the Other -- that ain't theory even if highly mediated...
kdag: have alsweys been in need
jaceee: it's fundamental...
kdag: always
efeefe: actually, I'm not even sure if that's in the conference or exhibition
jaceee: ;-) just like what we do here, now, isn't theory... it's life ;-]
lalenia: jaceee: Error: Spurious "]". You may want to quote your arguments with double quotes in order to prevent extra brackets from being evaluated as nested commands.
efeefe: jaceee: agreed
efeefe: talking is making
jerneja: jacee so true.
intertwili: i'd be happy & willing to engage another brico in an extended interview/dialogue (but perhaps not terribly extended!)
patadeperr: im just a bit obessed with action over discussion. meeting to make things instead of taliking for examples, seems fundamental, you have to admit we have done alot of talking the bricos...
patadeperr: This could be a nice oportunity to do a bit more action...
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kiilo: hi brian
patadeperr: perhaps all the participants could bring soemthing to Helsinki and with all the things make one thing..
efeefe: patadeperro: I think a good number of us is involved with concrete actions everyday
jaceee: (it's in the extension (beyond the normative) that we break into new territory and paradigms, Steven ;-)
paulav: yes patadeperro
paulav: hola
jerneja: point. the call should have indicative deadline. all the rest is up to the constellation. tapmap thanks for sharing invisibleconstellation work btw
kdag: patadeperro: i had the same feeling on my first meeting here on IRC like 3 weeks ago
paulav: hello, i am sorry.
efeefe: but I reckon it is the nature of a 'network' emerging from a mailing list to be pretty talkative
efeefe: people, I must leave pretty soon
kdag: and as tapmak said, there's never enough of TIY and "thinking is making"
efeefe: jerneja: what is the constellation?
jaceee: pata: but also each of us is involved in action as well, they cannot be separated and called better or worse, as Tapio points out... they are a seamless part of life, both, thoughts and actions... words and deeds
jerneja: of the combination of the chosen person to do the interview with
patadeperr: i agree and i have benfited greatly form all of our talks, i just hope, push for something concrete in Helsinki ..one action together...
tapmak: I agree that sharing practices that have emerged and been imporant for bricos should be highlighted in Helsinki. We talk about audience only some know about this network...
jaceee: (lets dance!)
intertwili: extensions beyond the normative yes ... beyond space/time possibilities not is rather what i meant
efeefe: but that's an important issue we should have in mind for our plans
jaceee: hehe, I knew that Steven, just poking ;-)
efeefe: so, daughter on my lap - need to leave
tapmak: efeefe/jerneja: A project two friends from Delhi are working with that looks at radical urban transformations but tries to look at connection points between different locations. Posted the url earlier.
efeefe: I haven't heard from HONF, anyone in contact with Venzha or Gustaff these days?
jerneja: not these days
kdag: not since last summer
jerneja: seen lots of activity they had earlier with lifepatch workshop
efeefe: I copied them in the first PVT emails, had no reply
kiilo: could be made
tapmak: I am talking with Andreas from Honf recently
kdag: http://www.invisibleconstellation.net/ thats the url that tapio posted earlier
lalenia: Title: Invisible Constellation - Main (at www.invisibleconstellation.net)
efeefe: also James is busy this week, spending some time here in Brazil
kiilo: connection to honf a friend was just there
efeefe:kdag: ah, right
intertwili: i'm in fairly regular contact with HONF regarding MICRONATIONS / MACRONATIONS and sometimes with Gustaff
efeefe: it would be great to have them involved in pixelache/brico
efeefe: jaromil is silent as well
jerneja: will buzz them. yes.
kdag: efeefe: i thinks we need to email with action oriented requests to fill some gaps
efeefe: anyway, let's continue via mailing list and meet again next wed?
intertwili: more on HONF also coming up ... with a request to support them in a remote discussion during their presentation at UNESCO HQ end february (but that's another issue, only tangential to pixelache)
tapmak: lots of water related work going on there now too that would connect with many of us... (HONF + hacteria )
efeefe:kdag: agreed. do that later.
kiilo: also there is another lab upcoming in yogya - liepatch
kdag: k
kiilo: lifepatch
kdag: liepatch sounds good
efeefe: waterlabs have been discussed in brico, underrepresented in our recent discussions
efeefe: ok, leaving now. if this goes on, can someone please post the log to the mailing list?
efeefe: better yet, I'll leave the computer open, but won't be here
kiilo: their website http://lifepatch.org/Main_Page
lalenia: Title: Lifepatch - citizen initiative in art, science and technology - Lifepatch - citizen initiative in art, science and technology (at lifepatch.org)
efeefe: cool, bye then
tapmak: Ivan and Kasia and myself are on the water track too.
kdag: bye
tapmak: Efeefe: can you share after IRC ok dates for visiting UBA past 11th?
jerneja: c u. also hackteria lab is happening now in bangalore http://ln-s.net/+YVL
lalenia: Title: HackteriaLab 2013 - Bangalore - Hackteria (at ln-s.net)
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tapmak: yup, I wanted to go there but I was in India just recently so could not get another visa.
jaceee: I'll put the IRC log up much later tonite ...
kdag: was invited and had to say no cause no time to make the visa
brv: hello
intertwili: g'night all, i have to check out ... good luck with it all!
kdag: ciao intertwilight
kdag: ola bruno
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brv: oi kdag
tapmak: good night Steve - Bruno, all.
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jaceee: ciao everyone!
jerneja: till next wed.
jaceee: I'll leave the channel log open for a bit more today...
vx: pls - i have a quick update
vx: just finishing off a call but we can do something with several aborigine groups in may - thats sorted if you wish for it
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vx: ok - so basically there are quite a few convergences going to be happening. i was just organising some work to assist the reunifying of the americas - the eagle and the condor, north and south, masculine and feminine....and there is now talk of seeing how that can merge with other native cultures - at present we are looking to establish links between americas and australia and new zealance
vx: zealand
jerneja: amazing!
vx: by no means is that exhaustive. and we will be doing a range of telepresence and physical activities from march this year to march next year (at least). there can be inclusion of 'aborigine' groups in a telepresence activity as bricolabs contribution to pixelache - was just agreed upon if you like
vx: and then we have a group in manchester who are from the 'diaspora' called southern voices who would be happy to participate remotely plus a group i am working with called co-lab who have software and tools available for knowledge sharing between north and south - timebanking and alternative media and currencies etc....
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Log file closed at: 1/30/13 15:57:8